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Post by slim on Jan 29, 2018 20:05:23 GMT -8
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Post by afx on Jan 30, 2018 3:57:41 GMT -8
Keith Marks offers a very nice Corvette sheet. You can email him at: mofobow@hotmail.com  |
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Post by slim on Jan 30, 2018 9:24:05 GMT -8
Thank you
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Post by Oldtimer on Jan 30, 2018 9:34:17 GMT -8
Wouldn't a 1957 Corvette in B-Production use either Fuel Injection, or one-Four Barrel? I don't recall two-Four Barrels being available at that time.
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Post by slim on Jan 30, 2018 11:01:57 GMT -8
I don't have a fuel injection system in 1/25 in my stash yet. Still new to the genre. According to my research the two carb set up was an option, and the F.I., only put out thirteen more HP. And they we're allegedly finicky that first year. It's not to late to late to change my plans. I like to let my imagination go on fictional builds but like to stay reasonably plausible. I have a lot to learn here. Thank you for your comment.
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Post by slim on Jan 30, 2018 11:09:14 GMT -8
Double checked my references, the two 4bbl was a 270 HP option #469C. But I don't know what the SCCA had to say about it.
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Post by Oldtimer on Jan 30, 2018 11:18:03 GMT -8
Double checked my references, the two 4bbl was a 270 HP option #469C. But I don't know what the SCCA had to say about it. Production cars had to be homologated, which means that the equipment that they could race with had to be listed in advance, by the manufacturer, and approved by the Sports Car Club of America before the car would be allowed to compete in that class.
And it didn't matter if the manufacturer offered that specific configuration to the general public, if it wasn't in the homologation papers, you couldn't race with it.
I will admit that I am not old enough (close, but not quite) to have been competing when the 1957 Corvettes were, but by the time I was (late 60's), the B-Production Corvettes were running single four barrels.
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Post by slim on Jan 30, 2018 11:28:56 GMT -8
Thanks for the information, I was only 10 when these cars raced as new. Would have been easier if I had the fuelie. So what class would it have to race in if it had two 4bbls? Racing 101, here. LOL!
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Post by Oldtimer on Jan 30, 2018 11:53:29 GMT -8
Thanks for the information, I was only 10 when these cars raced as new. Would have been easier if I had the fuelie. So what class would it have to race in if it had two 4bbls? Racing 101, here. LOL! And I apologize for getting so specific that it takes some of the enjoyment out of kitbashing.
If a competitor had showed up, and two-four barrels were not homologated ("legal"), then they would have let him race, if he met all other qualifications for safety equipment, but would bump him up to C-Modified (which was the, more or less, run what you brung class). This class eventually became A-Sports Racing, to accommodate Group 7 cars, like the Lola T-70's and McLaren Can Am cars.
Look down in the lower section of the forum and find the Super 8 movies I posted from 1967.
One of the cars that showed up was a Corvette Grand Sport. Even if it had a legal engine configuration, because not enough of them had been built with the body modifications (among other things), they were never homologated as a GT or Production car (so you see CM on the side); as opposed to the 289 and 427 Shelby Cobras, which did have sufficient numbers produced to have proper homologation papers filed, and allowed to run in either A or B Production.
GTO by the way, is the anglicized abbreviation of the Italian term Gran Tourismo Omologato (GTO).
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Post by slim on Jan 30, 2018 13:28:04 GMT -8
No apology needed! This is why I am here! Needed a diversion from building stock cars and this forum is just what I needed. Thank you for taking the time to share! It won't be the last time, I reckon!
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Post by Oldtimer on Jan 30, 2018 13:46:15 GMT -8
No apology needed! This is why I am here! Needed a diversion from building stock cars and this forum is just what I needed. Thank you for taking the time to share! It won't be the last time, I reckon! I started collecting and then subsequently modifying 1/18 scale diecast when I quit racing sports cars in the mid 90's. It allows me to apply some of the mechanical skills I acquired, while also keeping my mind into auto racing (as opposed to simply watching on TV or attending every now and then).
I started out crewing on another guy's car in the late 60's, bought the Camaro in my avatar in the mid 70's, and then raced two other cars (a Corvette and then a Camaro) until my partner and I split our racing program in the mid 90's.
The Sports Car Club of America, as some others here will vouch, sometimes took on more of the feeling of a cult versus a sanctioning body. The only difference between some SCCA members and others, is that we only sat on the sidelines and watched as the others drank deeply of the Kool Aid.
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Post by slim on Jan 30, 2018 14:55:09 GMT -8
I appreciate you comments, makes me feel welcome. I just want to build models and have fun. When I'm not playing music and having fun! Fun is a big part of my retirement package!
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Post by dustymojave on Jan 31, 2018 0:59:25 GMT -8
I suppose that I "wised up" before the kool-aid turned fatal. I got diverted into offroad racing. More of a 3-dimensional motorsport. Anyway, with the thought of this issue, I checked my original 1972 GCR (General Competition Regulations - the rule book that told inspectors what the race cars in Production classes should be built like) with 1973 updates. SCCA used to publish a new rule book whenever there had been enough changes to warrant printing an entire new book, but published pages to insert into older books at regular intervals. And if you were a member of SCCA, you got those updates mailed to you as they were published. I was then (early '70s) an SCCA Tech Inspector. I have my '73 issue as earlier editions had been superseded and I replaced the old with the new as I went along. I kept my rule books bound with the 2-prong sliding clamps so I could update them as I went along. I stopped working SCCA Tech in 1975, so the '73 updates were the latest I had. The homologation of any car was very rarely altered over the years, and the older the car got, the less likely the factory paid any attention to homologation papers for it. So I'm going to consider the 1972 issue of the page for Corvette 283 to be pretty well representative for Corvettes that came from Chevy with a 283 engine. The page does NOT include any indication of year models included, so I'm going to infer that ALL of the years Corvettes were offered with a 283ci engine are included. That would be 1957-1961. Under "carburetion" it lists "Rochester fuel-injection (see alternate below)" At the bottom of the page under "Alternate Specifications" it lists "Alternate carburetion: one or two Carter 4Bbl" So I conclude that even in the late 1950s, and all the way up to when SCCA created the GT1/2/3/4 classes, anyone of the 3 different optional carburetion setups would have been acceptable all in the same class. 1-4bbl carb, 2-4bbl carb, or Rochester fuel injection would be appropriate. On the engine dyno, the 2x 4bbl might have competed with the fuel injection for max hp. But on the track, the 1 x 4bbl may well have provided the best tractability and widest power band for general purpose use on a road race car. Road racing is not the same as drag racing or super speedway where max hp at high rpm at wide open throttle is what you're after. For road racing, an engine has to work well at low and mid throttle too. That's why in open sports racers big Chrysler Hemis could not keep up with small block Ford and Chevies or even 215ci aluminum Olds engined cars. Good call though oldtimer. I had to look it up. Slim, that Vette looks good. Back in the day, Vettes on tracks with long straights had trouble with the stock windshield folding back from wind pressure. Stingrays had more trouble than C1 Vettes. In fact, I was told as a Tech Inspector to not allow a stock windshield on C1 or C2 Vettes for races at Riverside. So plexiglas windscreens were popular. So I would cut that windscreen down even further. However, I ran across a picture on the net of a late C1 Vette SCCA road racer with a windscreen very much like yours. So go for it the way it is. Seat belts should be 4-point with 3" lap belts and 2" shoulder belts with lever latches and leather pads behind the latches. Rules stated that bumpers may be removed, but not grilles. I like early Vettes without the grille, but that was a no-no. Here's a picture of Doug Hooper's Vette racing in SoCal.  Wiper arms could be removed, but the wiper mechanism had to remain and be workable. So the shafts should stick out of the cowl. .020" /0.5mm craft wire would work for those. Headlight glass may be removed or must be criss-cross taped to keep the glass from scattering on the track in a crash. |
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Post by Oldtimer on Jan 31, 2018 5:46:52 GMT -8
I stand corrected on the carbs, but made you look!  When I first got my '69 Camaro, it had already been converted to a single four barrel (this was in '75 or '76), and all the contemporary B-Production Corvette's were running 350's with a single four barrel, as well. |
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Post by Oldtimer on Jan 31, 2018 5:51:59 GMT -8
I appreciate you comments, makes me feel welcome. I just want to build models and have fun. When I'm not playing music and having fun! Fun is a big part of my retirement package! I'm sneaking up on my retirement as well, and positioning to be able to do more custom 1/18 scale models, when I'm not out in my yard or Scuba diving. |
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